Geoffrey, muh man, I've just said a quick prayer for your girl. To alert a child to the changes they will undergo is one thing. To present perversions as simply sexual diversity is reprehensible. As things are going now, don't be surprised if she winds up pregnant early with the very decisions she didn't need to make and wouldn't have to if she was taught to put sex in it's proper place.
First of all, one person's perversion is another's Friday night frolic. That's just the way the cookie crumbles. More to the point, I find it fascinating that there are so many people concerned with how other people raise their children. I have indicated that we are working for an open line of communication with our children on this issue, and that we are teaching our daughters that "difference" does not equate with "wrong" - and somehow, Marshall decides to warn me that because of that, my daughter is going to get pregnant.
If she does, you know what, Marshall? We will be there with her every step of the way. We will not judge, we will not be angry, we won't be disappointed, we will give her as much help as we can, and we will never, ever stop loving her. That, however, is hardly the issue.
Why, on God's green earth, is it wrong to tell children that people are people? Why, on God's green earth, is it wrong to tell children that love is far better than deciding how other's are to live?
I want to tell a story out of school, as it were. I hope I will be forgiven for this, but I will not use names to protect the innocent. In March of 1989, my youngest sister, living in Massachusetts with her boyfriend, called our house. She talked to my mother for close to two hours. She had not contacted my parents for three months, and we found out why that evening - she was pregnant, and terrified of my parents' reaction. My parents' reaction? As I was standing in the kitchen when my mother and father talked about this, I can give a first-hand account - Is that all? My mother added, "I thought it might be that" for good measure.
That child is a freshman on a full-ride scholarship to Dartmouth College, studying chemistry right now.
The point of this little family anecdote is simple - I learned how to raise my children, and love them no matter what, and accept their mistakes, from two people I admire more than any others - my parents, Daniel and Virginia Safford. I honestly don't think anything Marshall has said, or will say, about raising children, can compare to the lesson I learned that March evening eighteen years ago. However, I open this discussion to other parents out there - DL, ER, Jim, Sis - for their input.
11 comments:
A wonderful family anecdote that clearly illustrates my stance on the issue. My wife and I will love our children no matter what they choose to do, and we will accept them as they are. Simple.
I wish my parents could have been so accepting. I might actually have a relationship if they were not so anxious to control my (and my sister's) life. But then, that would have required them to not to threaten to kill my brother-in-law and then ask me to pretend it never happened. It would have required that my mother not ask when Lauria was due when I told her that Lauria and I were engaged. It would have required that my father be willing to disagree with my mother publicly, when he knows that she was wrong. My parents chose the path that Marshall advocates, and my relationship with my parents is forever severed, for my safety and the safety of my family.
I'm glad that your family gave you the gift of a positive lesson on love, instead of a negative. I salute your parents.
I remember your struggles with your parents when we were in college. At the time I was still naive and very cosseted, and I had no idea that there were people who behaved in such a way. I am sad for you, Jim, because you were put in a position where you had no choice but to do what you have done, as you say, for your own, and your family's, safety.
Whatever feelings of disappointment, or sadness, my parents had with my sister's situation, they kept it to themselves in th discussion when I was present. I should note that, at the time, my sister was 27, and had been working hard to support herself for many years. Having a baby in those circumstances, with or without a marriage commitment, would have been difficult to say the least. She has always worked hard, though, and my nephew and his sister are very wonderful individuals because my sister is a wonderful person. That her first husband, and father of her two children, is not, merely means that my sister, like everyone else, can be fooled by circumstances.
Being a parent is awful, horrible, terrible, never-ending stuff. I am never happy with my own parenting, and constantly wonder if both my girls wouldn't do better with another. On the other hand, we laugh together, sing together, I help them with their homework and they remind me of the simple joys of living, and I wouldn't trade it all for the world. Why would I burden them with guilt and frustration when sometimes just getting from sunrise to bedtime can be a strain, regardless of age? Better to teach them to love, and that love is never wrong, than to convince them that there are such things as "perversions" out there, and that they are evil horrible people if they make mistakes.
Well, I don't know what the songs say, 'cause I jsut can't sit through 'em without extralegal inducemtns, which I haven't employed for a dozen years now -- no offense!
But inb my case, I knew my Bird was smart about knowing that decisions made now in haste cause circumstances later that are inconceivable -- which my own guiding principal.
I'm pretty sure that Bird didn't have intercourse until college, but she may have in her senior year. But, really, I think she is engaged now to her first, her college sweetheart -- and even talking about it makews me queesey. It's her business, not mine. Even in high school, it was her business -- but so then would have been the results. But I'da helped her deal with it.
Notice that "morality" has had nothing to do with anything I've said. It couldn't. Morality had nothing to do with my deicsion to abstain until I was 21. The unpredictabl;e consequences did.
Shoot, the main thing that got me pissed at my Bird was her runing off and gettin a tattoo -- falsely thinking *that* would piss me, and her mama, off. Nope. The sneaking around and the dishomnesty dang sure did, tho.
I just want to protect my neice from idiot lefties like yourself and your love of homosexuals and laissez faire sexuality.
Let's hope Goat's niece wants his "protection."
I don't know anything about raising children ... don't have any, not going to have any. But my parents were wonderful parents and they never felt the need to put us kids in a bunker to "protect us". Instead they raised us with the tools (intelligence, ethics, responsibility) to protect ourselves and gave us the love and independence we needed to occasionally screw up.
(They also raised us with manners and taught us how to mind our own business. Let's all pray for MA's kids and Goat's neice as it appears unlikely that either of those guys are equipped to teach those lessons.)
I've taught kids of all ages, from elementary to college, and one thing I've seen over and over: kids from ultra-overprotective homes are the biggest hellions. Ask any teacher, they'll tell you the same thing. Those kids simply don't know how to behave themselves because they've never had the opportunity to behave *themselves*. They don't know anything about ethical decision making because they've never had the chance to do it. You can only teach responsibility by giving kids some responsibility.
Call me crazy.. But, the NY Times seems to think the compassionate conservative approach of covering your eyes and saying lots of prayers doesnt work.
PS: Nice to see somebody let the mental animals out of the barn.
You know, I often wonder why people on the right feel they need to "protect" others, especially when that protection is usually directed at those for whom they do not have direct responsibility.
I would much rather do two things - protect my children as much as possible from harm, but also give them the tools to make intelligent, informed decisions once they are on their own. That is also a form of protection.
This has been an interesting discussion.
Continue if you wish.
It has taken me days to be able to comment on this thread. That jackass has essentially,tried to do some hoodoo voodoo on your daughter and damn her to aateenage pregnancy....'oh Geoff repent now I will make your daughter a teen age mother..."What a crock of shit.We raised our children essentially as you are raising yours. We discussed what ever questions they had about sexuality,homosexuality,etc as openly as we could. When I say as open as we could,I mean because we as adults were embarrased on some topics,but we believed to be honest and open about things takes all the mystery and wondering out.
Now believe it or not,my daughter was not a vicitm of an early pregnancy. Hard to believe when her parents were such open perverts huh. As a matter of fact she remained a virgin until after her 18th birthday, How do I know? Because she told me. SHe was a senior in high school and was dating a young man who was 21. She came to me and said she needed birth control and didnt want to rely on condoms.Whew,what a much better way for it to be,then to find me her,her father and me crying because of an accidental pregnancy because she was too scared to ask for help in getting birth control.Would we have cried because we thought she was a sinner and a whore? No, we would have cried because we know that having a child in high school means that some of the things that we might consider normal cant be done. Now this daughter is almost 28 and guess what.... She still doesnt have any children. SHe is married, but she has never really wanted children. Now I guess marshall will say she is selfish. Can you beleive that there are people that she knows that have told her this. If we tried to make everyone else happy we would go mad.My son was 29 when he and his wife gave us a grandchild. He also managed not to spawn any demon seed out of wedlock or in high school. So sorry to say for old Marshall,being rational,intelligent and not a hate and fear monger does not make teen age mothers.
Ok i better go now before my rant gets worse. Love ya,Your perverted,sex feindish oldest sister.
Since we both know we are descended from weak-willed, crotch-centered people on both sides of the tree, I guess we are who we are.
I wish you knew how proud I was of both your kids, sis. I missed a big chunk of their growing up, moving first to DC then VA, but knowing who they were as small children, then now as adults - I just can't tell you how much I admire both of them. Them, and our youngest sister's children, are how I hope my girls end up.
Well thanks Geoff,that was very nice to hear. I mean that sincerely. Also I wanted to say...'power to the crotch centered people'. Our sister's kids are great,as are all the other nieces and nephews. Your girls will turn out great. They can't miss,with Lisa as their mother....lol. OK enough of the family stuff,your other readers will be barfing.
I am gonna go do my Saturday errand stuff. Go to the Amish store and buy some staples...now there are some crotch centered people...8-10 kids...geezzz,get a TV or something..Love ya...Sis
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